Talk:Dog

DYK nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by AirshipJungleman29 talk 15:00, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

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• Comment or view
• Article history

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Various types of dogs.

• ... that dogs (examples pictured) were domesticated from wolves over 14,000 years ago by hunter-gatherers, before the development of agriculture? Source: https://www.pnas.org/doi/full/10.1073/pnas.2010083118 https://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822(15)00432-7
  • ALT1: ... that humans have consumed dog (example pictured) meat for at least 14,000 years? Source: https://books.google.co.za/books?id=JwGZTQunH00C&pg=PA208&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false
  • Reviewed:

Improved to Good Article status by Wolverine X-eye (talk). Number of QPQs required: 0. Nominator has fewer than 5 past nominations.

Wolverine XI ^{(talk to me)} 09:14, 20 October 2024 (UTC).

• Comments: ALT1 is going to make a lot of people upset. I should know, as I'm from South Korea, where dog meat is still eaten. BorgQueen (talk) 09:38, 20 October 2024 (UTC)

All the better for views if you ask me, but technically that hook would be about dog meat and thus it would fail WP:DYKHOOKSTYLE, so with regret I've struck it. ALT0 is available for review; might have a rummage for hooks myself. (Also, that image of 'a female dog nursing' is adorable.)--Launchballer 19:28, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

• Article received a GA review seven days before DYK nom, so it's new enough. It's definitely long enough, and I'm going to trust that the GA process addressed any potential concerns about sourcing. The hook is interesting, and the image is freely-licensed. QPQ is not required. Personally I think it would be nice to have an image comparing a dog to a wolf since the hook makes mention of both, but that's just my personal opinion. Overall, it seems good to go! Di (they-them) (talk) 12:01, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

  Now that I mention it, might I suggest this alt image? commons:File:Comparison of a wolf and a pug.png. Di (they-them) (talk) 12:26, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

  That image is low-quality IMO, so no, not that one. I would instead prefer a husky since it looks somewhat similar to a wolf. Wolverine X-eye ^{(talk to me)} 12:39, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

I'm doing a tick to make clear that this comment is not an objection, but just excerpts from the two sources verifying the hook fact. The earlier article says, "The researchers determined that dogs were probably domesticated from now-extinct wolves between 11,000 and 16,000 years ago — before humans began farming around 10,000 years ago."[1] and the more recent article pushes this timeline back further,[2] "Dogs were the first domesticated species and the only animal known to enter into a domestic relationship with people during the Pleistocene [...] dogs were domesticated in Siberia by 23,000 years ago, possibly while both people and wolves were isolated during the harsh climate of the Last Glacial Maximum. Dogs then accompanied the first people into the Americas and traveled with them as humans rapidly dispersed into the continent beginning 15,000 years ago [...] The earliest generally accepted dog dates to 15 ka (from the site of Bonn-Oberkassel, discussed below). However, claims for the existence of domestic dogs as early as 40 ka (22–28) have been made on the basis of morphological (22, 24–27), isotopic (22, 29), genetic (22, 28, 30), and contextual assessments (24, 31) of ancient canid remains. Yet, none of these potential domestication markers is fail-safe, owing to the fact that wolves and early domesticated dogs can be difficult to distinguish from each other." Rjjⁱⁱⁱ (talk) 00:49, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

@BorgQueen: A month has now passed and this nomination has seemingly been forgotten. Can you promote this anytime soon? I would like the hook to appear this year. Thanks, Wolverine X-eye ^{(talk to me)} 21:28, 25 November 2024 (UTC)

"Female dog" or "bitch"?

Traumnovelle, why change "female dog" to "bitch"?[3] Does that not go against MOS:JARGON, "Some topics are necessarily technical: however, editors should seek to write articles accessible to the greatest possible number of readers. Minimize the use of jargon? Rjjⁱⁱⁱ (talk) 02:40, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Bitch is not a jargon term, it is a term in common parlance. I don't see how it can qualify as jargon but sobriquet doesn't. Traumnovelle (talk) 03:02, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

I work in the veterinary field, and "Bitch" is the correct veterinary term for a female dog. It is not derogatory when used in this context. Mediatech492 (talk) 07:23, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

I do not consider "bitch" jargon any more than, for example, "bull" or "cow", or "stallion" or "mare". It is not as common only because of its secondary vulgar meaning - much like "ass" often is avoided even when speaking of that animal. That said, I have no strong opinion on whether to use "bitch" or "female dog" throughout the article; the two are interchangeable. Jtrevor99 (talk) 12:12, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

The specific terminology of the veterinary field is jargon, by the very definition of the term. It would be highly unusual for someone outside the veterinary field to refer to a female dog as a bitch, unless making a joke or trying to get a rise out of someone. 68.71.31.171 (talk) 01:24, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

It is not jargon. The term is not just used in the veterinary field: it is used in everyday vernacular by many English-speaking groups outside the US (to refer to the animal), not to mention breeders, kennels, dog shows, conservation departments, farmers, and many other specialized groups. It cannot be "jargon" when used throughout the populace. Frankly, I'm surprised anyone would try to argue that it is jargon: I've never seen anyone try to claim a term referring to the male or female of any species is jargon, except here. So let's be honest: it's likely this is a straw man argument, at least for some, who wish to remove the term because of its alternative derogatory meaning. And, I see no need to use it when it's a synonym for "female dog". But there's no compelling reason to avoid it either. Jtrevor99 (talk) 03:24, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Again, the specific terminology of "specialized groups" is, by definition, jargon. 68.71.31.171 (talk) 14:00, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Again, the specific terminology of "everyday vernacular" is, by definition, not jargon. Jtrevor99 (talk) 14:50, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

If you read the comment that I was responding to, you will see that the word was "everyday vernacular" used by "specialized groups," not the public. 142.115.60.108 (talk) 00:57, 3 November 2024 (UTC)

I WROTE that comment. Read it again. You misunderstood it. Jtrevor99 (talk) 01:03, 3 November 2024 (UTC)

Is ewe or mare jargon? I would argue most of these terms are less commonly recognised (esp. in an urban population) but are still used in the relevant Wikipedia article instead of the queer 'females'. Traumnovelle (talk) 04:01, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Just because ignorant people use a word as a derogatory term does not negate that fact that the word is correct when used in the proper context. The word "cock" has profane usage, but that does not change the fact that it means a male chicken. It also has a different, non-profane meaning in reference to firearms. One could go on with terms like "ass", "pussy" and "Jesus Christ" which have both profane and non-profane usage. Mediatech492 (talk) 05:19, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Insulting members of the public by calling them "ignorant people" doesn't help your case. Wikipedia is written for the public. That's why we don't use specialized language, such as the language you use as a member of the veterinary profession. Stop looking down your nose at those of us who don't have veterinary training. 68.71.31.171 (talk) 14:00, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Interesting that you are concerned about the "public" when your comments are US-centric. The term is much more commonly used outside of the US, to refer to the female animal. Jtrevor99 (talk) 14:51, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Interesting that you would jump to the conclusion that my comments are US-centric. I am not American, none of my ancestors are American, and I have never lived in the United States. Regardless, the rule here is that we use a form of English understandable throughout the English speaking world, even in the United States. 142.115.60.108 (talk) 00:57, 3 November 2024 (UTC)

Just to note Horse and Sheep naturally introduce the respective terms and then use them. It would be easy to include into the lead as either terminology or naturally introduced. Traumnovelle (talk) 19:08, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Yes, But there are kids (idk on a computer/iPad) On Wikipedia, and if they like dogs they would search dog on the Wikipedia thingy. maybe they would click on the Talk page. or if they don't click on it both ways will they see Bitch (used for dog). these are developing minds, so they could say bitch and their parents/guardian will think its the swear word. I'm not saying you should remove it (This was 6 months ago) but still, add a disclaimer (I'm too lazy to do it) IdioticBlender (talk) 22:49, 17 April 2025 (UTC)

There are much worse words for a child to learn on Wikipedia than 'bitch'. See also WP:NODISCLAIMER. Traumnovelle (talk) 22:55, 17 April 2025 (UTC)

Such as?? IdioticBlender (talk) 22:57, 17 April 2025 (UTC)

List of ethnic slurs is probably a good place to start. Traumnovelle (talk) 23:03, 17 April 2025 (UTC)

Yes. But Also Kids can be exposed to Nudity, and Sex Bots, Bots, UTTP, And The N Word, A bypass of youtube for it, (NIGA or NIGG) (not trying to be racist). I clearly Understand what you mean now, and I understand That kids can be exposed to stuff like [[Only Fans | OF]. IdioticBlender (talk) 23:08, 17 April 2025 (UTC)

Mistaken interpretation of path to domesticity

The sentence 'the dog is a domestic animal that likely travelled a commensal pathway into domestication (i.e. dogs neither benefited nor got harmed)' does not interpret the referenced sources correctly. A commensal relationship is on in which one animal derives benefit and the other derives neither benefit nor harm. The referenced source says, "free-ranging wolves attracted to the refuse generated by human camps most likely followed a commensal pathway to domestication that was neither deliberate nor directed." In this description, the proto-dogs did benefit by being able to eat human refuse, while humans in this initial phase of the relationship were neither benefitted nor harmed. The sentence would be more accurate if it said somethin like, 'the dog is a domestic animal that likely travelled a commensal pathway into domestication (i.e. dogs benefited from eating the refuse of human camps while humans neither benefitted nor got harmed)' 2600:1702:4E34:4F8F:F10F:D998:C340:997B (talk) 03:26, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

I've done a slightly reworded version of your suggestion. Thanks for catching that. For less-watched pages, you can also used the template listed at Wikipedia:Edit requests to propose suggestions to locked articles, Rjjⁱⁱⁱ (talk) 23:03, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 4 November 2024

Here’s a submission that follows Wikipedia’s edit request guidelines:

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• • Edit Request**
• Section:* "Senses" under "Anatomy and Physiology"

Suggested Text Addition: Add the following paragraph after the sentence: "This sense of smell is the most prominent sense of the species; it detects chemical changes in the environment, allowing dogs to pinpoint the location of mating partners, potential stressors, resources, etc."

> "In addition to detecting environmental cues, a dog's highly developed olfactory system can recognize specific volatile organic compounds (VOCs) associated with various human diseases. This ability allows trained dogs to identify conditions such as cancer, diabetes, and even infectious diseases like COVID-19, making them valuable as non-invasive diagnostic aids. Studies have shown that dogs’ disease-detection capabilities often match or exceed the sensitivity of some electronic diagnostic methods."

Source: 1. Jendrny et al. (2021). "Canine olfactory detection and its relevance to medical detection." *BMC Infectious Diseases*, 21:838. DOI: [10.1186/s12879-021-06523-8](https://doi.org/10.1186/s12879-021-06523-8). This study reviews dogs' ability to detect specific diseases through VOCs and discusses diagnostic accuracy that is sometimes greater than electronic methods.

This addition highlights the functional and diagnostic significance of the canine olfactory system, enhancing the existing information in the "Senses" section. Aliceev (talk) 00:54, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

 Not done - 1, we can't accept LLM (that is, AI) generated text, and 2, the idea that dogs can detect COVID is a controversial medical claim and would require very strong sourcing. - MrOllie (talk) 01:06, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

Should "Canis lupus" come first?

The very beginning of the intro says "The dog (Canis familiaris or Canis lupus familiaris) is...." From what I can tell, both from this article's Taxonomy section and from the Integrated Taxonomic Information System (ITIS; itis.gov), Canis lupus familiaris is the accepted classification. Some experts disagree, preferring Canis familiaris, but apparently the accepted one is Canis lupus familiaris. Shouldn't the latter come first at the beginning of the intro? DKMell (talk) 04:09, 14 November 2024 (UTC)

ITIS actually lists both forms. I can see that by looking at the taxonbar at the bottom of the page. From there I can also see that a majority of the more well respected taxa databases seem to prefer C. familiaris to C. l. familiaris. So no, I can't support this suggestion. - UtherSRG (talk) 12:22, 14 November 2024 (UTC)

Agreed. The article once cited Dogs: Their Fossil Relatives and Evolutionary History by the widely respected paleontologists Wang & Tedford, with both classifications given on Page 1. Unfortunately, it is no longer referenced in this article. 14.2.200.245 (talk) 11:06, 4 March 2025 (UTC)

Typo fix

I'm not meeting requirements to edit semi-protected articles, so I write here that someone else can do a minor-edit fix:

At the "Competitors" paragraph have a look at last words. "[...]the kagu, in New Caledonia.[162]". The linked word "kagu" needs to be edited to have an uppercase K-letter. Ayniar (talk) 11:17, 20 November 2024 (UTC)

@Ayniar just did it, thanks for pointing that out! Gaismagorm (talk) 11:53, 20 November 2024 (UTC)

I've undone this. Kagu uses lowercase. Traumnovelle (talk) 20:32, 20 November 2024 (UTC)

Ah okay, my bad! Gaismagorm (talk) 01:18, 21 November 2024 (UTC)

poorly worded statement about pet/feral dog percentage

In the article it says: "In developed countries, around 20% of dogs are kept as pets, while 75% of the population in developing countries largely consists of feral and community dogs."

To me, this reads as potentially implying that 80% of dogs in developed countries are free-ranging, which is clearly wrong.

Suggestion: Flag as needing a citation or just plain remove it. SophiaBZhou (talk) 22:52, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

I disagree with that; however, the source clearly states 'If one assumes that all of the pet dogs in developed countries

are restricted they would represent 17–24% of the dogs worldwide' which instead means that 17-24% of dogs worldwide are from developed countries. Traumnovelle (talk) 23:04, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

Temporal range in Infobox?

The top of the infobox says "Temporal range: 0.0142–0 Ma". without any clarification. The link sends the reader to year, which is just confusing. Something needs to be fixed. ypn^2 00:45, 5 December 2024 (UTC)

It sends the reader to the section of year that describes what the abbreviation Ma means, and right below it is "Late Pleistocene to present" with a citation that should give more information. It's a little more obvious in articles like Coelacanth where the geological age is placed first and the time period bar is actually visible. Reconrabbit 01:30, 5 December 2024 (UTC)

Which Is is?

This article says the domestication of dogs began around 14,000 years ago. The article on the domestication of dogs says it happened over 30,000 years ago. Which is it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.241.240.42 (talk) 03:12, 5 December 2024 (UTC)

From this article: "Dogs were domesticated from wolves over 14,000 years ago by hunter-gatherers, before the development of agriculture. The remains of the Bonn–Oberkassel dog, buried alongside humans between 14,000 and 15,000 years ago, are the earliest to be conclusively identified as a domesticated dog. Genetic studies show that dogs likely diverged from wolves between 27,000 and 40,000 years ago." Rjjⁱⁱⁱ (talk) 05:10, 7 March 2025 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 20 February 2025

I would like to add a couple things about dog breeds! Dgcatcowchicken (talk) 18:25, 20 February 2025 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Annh07 (talk) 18:32, 20 February 2025 (UTC)