Talk:List of world association football records

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Top scorer in most continents

Sam Kerr (Australian Womans player) was top goal scorer in top flight womans professional leagues across 3 continents. And has done so more than once. Top scorer in WSL (Eng) 2021, 2022 - Europe Top Scorer - US 2018, 2019, Top Scorer - W League (Australia) 2018, 2019 49.179.29.84 (talk) 10:41, 6 December 2022 (UTC)

Removed content

Brito trofeu You're more than welcome to discuss here why you think this info shouldn't be removed. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 15:47, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

Pinging Joseph2302, Lee Vilenski, Spike 'em, Aquatic Ambiance, Super Nintendo Chalmers, Kante4 who previously provided excellent guidance and actions over at FIFA World Cup records and statistics. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 15:59, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

It's absolutely no secret that I really don't like these WP:INDISCRIMINATE lists of WP:TRIVIA. I don't really understand how we can have a scope for "all of the records" for football. It ends up being full of ridiculous stats that are fluff that have no sporting merit at all. See Highest number of siblings to score on the same day, and of a player playing two matches on the same day. Why do we need an image next to every stat? And, more to the point, why do we have just SO MANY articles on random tidbits in different competitions. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 16:23, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

Would this page be sufficiently replaced with a template that would have key records pages on it? --Super Nintendo Chalmers (talk) 09:22, 19 December 2022 (UTC)

Vsatin please discuss here. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 21:51, 26 December 2022 (UTC)

Any comment, Vsatin ? All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 18:31, 28 December 2022 (UTC)

My first comment is that ItsKesha should start writing, looking for and adding references, creating articles, instead of constantly going and removing tons of content and sources from various pages. More specifically, you cannot just go to an article that you never ever contributed to and delete half of it and on top of that to expect users who actually contribute to accept your preferred (deleted) version - and then you keep reverting.

Secondly, I am pinging users who have contributed to this specific article to see what they think @Dale Arnett:, @Achmad Rachmani:, @Taeguk:, @Brito trofeu:, @EverJoking:, @Svartner:, @Disgusto:, @BrownHairedGirl:, @Lorry Gundersen:, @FMSky:, @Dorrough618:, @Serols:, @Vanished user 2831328:. Thirdly, this specific arrticle is about world records in various domestic competitions and divisions all over the world and the records do not have to be only about goalscoring. If there is content that really has to be deleted could be the World competitions section as these records are already part of ie World Cup records etc. I don't think there is an Olympics records article for football, so this is something that could be created (maybe ItsKesha could start searching for sources and writing this article, for a change from only deleting content - just a suggestion). Vsatin (talk) 00:04, 29 December 2022 (UTC)

You have addressed none of the concerns raised, and you have failed to explain why the deleted content shouldn't be deleted. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 00:46, 29 December 2022 (UTC)

Issues with the page

• Lead too short - I mean, it's one sentence, this is indisputable
• Original research - right out the gate, Lewandowski and Hubner being top-scorer in three divisions
• Trivial content - much of the content might be "interesting" but is simply not encyclopaedic. Highest goalscoring defender (he isn't, the source actually says Yet Koeman was still first and foremost a defensive player, whether it be as a holding midfielder, centre-back or sweeper), RSSSF record goalscorer, "Player to win top-scorer awards in most continents"?
• Too broad - one minute the page is discussing the all-time leading goalscorers and appearance makers, valid things here even if there is already an article about those, to then mentioning that Juninho once placed for club and country and the same day (he isn't the only one), and that the Gudjohnsens once played in the same match (also, not the only ones). There is no coherency at all. Also, why are some random previous record holders mentioned but basically no others? Why are Sunday league and amateur and reserve team records in this article?
• Unreliable sources - YouTube, Sport Bible, Twitter, Michela Costa, Tribuna, The Sporting Blog, 90Soccer, Daily Nation Today, Foot The Ball... and many more
• Additional sources needed - as an example, the first table has 48 records and only 46 sources, many are completely unsourced
• Too many pictures - there simply isn't any need to have a 100 pictures in any article, it's too many
• Copy editing required - the details section specifically, numbers one to nine should be spelt out, don't use a footballer's first name, don't need to use full names or nationalities when already mentioned in the preceding columns. Also, there's no need to mention any ages unless specific to a record
• Overlinking - e.g. why is there eight links to Cristiano Ronaldo?

Also, the title of the article doesn't even make sense, what is "world association football"? All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 12:42, 29 December 2022 (UTC)

The sentence "world association football" has no meaning on any dictionary. Achmad Rachmani (talk) 07:50, 3 January 2023 (UTC)

Most of the issues you have raised can be fixed without the need of heavy content removal. Examples

• Copy editing can be fixed
• Overlinking can be corrected by unlinking the overlinked characters
• It is okay to have a short lead since details have been covered in the article
• By pictures you mean flags? Most of pages(if not all) about football use flags for easy identification. Take note of the flags in FIFA World Cup

EverJoking (talk) 15:04, 3 January 2023 (UTC)

It is a mistake to consider the RSSSF or Guinness Book statistical goal count as trivia, as the counting method used is different from the IFFHS. There is no single, unambiguous method. I have re-added this and the fastest recorded goal as they have more detailed articles explaining the criteria. Svartner (talk) 03:48, 11 January 2023 (UTC)

There aren't three sources for who the top goalscorer is. There's dozens, probably hundreds. RSSSF and Guinness are fringe sources. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 19:06, 12 January 2023 (UTC)

I insist, based on what do you consider this? RSSSF has the largest collection of football data in the world, the Guinness Book due to antiquity is also well accepted in most parts of the world too. Football has changed over the years, and the IFFHS criteria only makes sense for football for a few decades now.

There really was unfortunate/exaggerated information in the list previously, but in my opinion, you removed legitimate content along with it. Here I end my collaboration on this article, and I leave the reflection to the other members. Svartner (talk) 15:58, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

I base it on the reliable sources? What do the reliable sources say. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 18:34, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

Oldest footballer according to Guinness World Records

Hello!

The record in the subject was recently broken by another player. Whoever is willing to make the update, as at the moment I have no time to do it myself, but maybe I will do it myself later when there is time if no-one else does it, here are a couple of sources, as direct links/hyperlinks below:

Guinness World Records

Essentialy Sports

Kind regards,

Lorry Gundersen (talk) 15:55, 29 January 2023 (UTC)

Zico

Hello @Vsatin: Thank you for your beautiful edits. I have a few notes. Zico scored 62 goals from a free kick, not 101. I counted his 30 official goals with Udinese and found that he scored 12 goals, not 17 as you mentioned. After researching, I discovered that he scored a number of goals in friendly matches (one of which was against Real Madrid on August 5, 1983), so it seems that the number you put included friendly and official matches, and the consideration in this article is for official matches, so I will retrieve your edit, thank you. --Mishary94 (talk) 10:55, 29 December 2023 (UTC)

Different category for player with more thropies won

Any serious journalistic article, doesn't consider Lee Casciaro the player with most titles. This is logical, because it's Gibraltar League. It's a nearly amateur league. In 2013 has been acepted to enter FIFA and in 2016 they officialy joined. It's still changing rules, teams, etc to adapt to Europe standards. But let's say that Casciaro titles are official. This is are not top titles. There's no way you can put them along with titles won by Messi, Dani Alves, Iniesta, Benzema, Cristiano, etc. Gibraltar League is no where near as competitive Spanish B League, or even German C league. So let's find a category to agree so we can put the player who won most top competitive titles, as mayor leagues, mayor cups, etc. Another example is Ángel Romano from Uruguay. He won 50 titles. But in his time, football was amateur. There's no way you can compare to actual standards. If you put a record category, there must be the same way to judge contendants. That's why if you seach "most title winners" you will find thousands of articles about Messi, Alves, Iniesta, Maxwell, Cristiano, Kroos, etc, and none about Casciaro. Adannoes (talk) 13:56, 8 March 2024 (UTC)

Competitive titles? We're talking about official titles, no matter what they are. Wikipedia only mentions facts and does not take into account the standards of journalism. If the tournaments are local, they must be recognized by the official federation of the country itself, and if they are continental, they must be recognized by the continental federation (UEFA, CONMEBOL, etc.), we do not look at the titles. From a competitive standpoint, but from being an official, approved title, no matter how competitive or popular it is. As for Angel Romano, he has won 32 official titles, not 50. --Mishary94 (talk) 16:51, 8 March 2024 (UTC)

Players to win top-scorer awards in third, second, first division topscorer award

At least one player is missing from this list: Igor Protti.

https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Igor_Protti

Citing from the article: Along with Dario Hübner, Protti is the only player to have won the top scoring titles in Serie A, Serie B, and Serie C1. 87.19.203.116 (talk) 07:30, 9 March 2024 (UTC)

Done, Thank you for your note. --Mishary94 (talk) 18:33, 9 March 2024 (UTC)

Trivial information

Information such as "most left foot goals" and "most headed goals" is completely trivial and should not be included. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 11:10, 14 September 2024 (UTC)

I read the policies and did not find anything that contradicts what you removed. Penalty kicks, for example, are considered fundamental aspects of football, and there are reputable organizations that base their statistics and figures on them. So how can you consider them excessive information? We do not see them as excessive but rather essential. Therefore, due to the difference in perspectives between each of us, and in order to avoid an edit war, there must first be a discussion to agree on what is 'excessive information' or not. Mishary94 (talk) 16:17, 14 September 2024 (UTC)

I totally agree with Mishary. I support all this kind of records. Most of them are supported by IFFHS or RSSSF or even Guinness World Records in many cases. Kind regards! Juanan412 (talk) 19:40, 14 September 2024 (UTC)

Find me the reputable sources that have ever published a list of "most bicycle kicks", for example. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 22:00, 14 September 2024 (UTC)

"A list of indiscriminate examples often becomes a trivia magnet, which grows increasingly disorganized, unreliable, and difficult to read". /// "Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information, so some degree of selectivity should always be used". This wholly applies to this nonsense article. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 22:07, 14 September 2024 (UTC)

Dear, there is no randomness at all. It is well known that records and statistics are a very broad field. They may include goals, assists, match victories, championships, types of goals, ages, etc. Therefore, as long as the information is supported by credible sources, I don't think it's trivia magnet. Mishary94 (talk) 06:48, 15 September 2024 (UTC)

It doesn't just have to be "supported by credible sources", which many of the records even aren't, and many of which aren't even "records", they're just trivia. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 08:17, 15 September 2024 (UTC)

I don't know why women records are removed even when it says "including professionals, semi-professionals, amateurs, and women's football." Kind regards! Juanan412 (talk) 18:53, 19 September 2024 (UTC)

Women records weren't removed? All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 13:35, 20 September 2024 (UTC)

Ferguson is the one who won more titles in total. On the other hand, Bill Struth is the one who won the most first-division league titles. These are two different records. Juanan412 (talk) 11:24, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

The article says Struth has won 64 finals and 18 leagues. The 64 alone is significantly higher than Ferguson's 49. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 18:20, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

@ItsKesha: Please stop reverting the edits. What you are doing is imposing your opinion without a clear standard. I kindly ask you to read the following points:

• Penalty kicks are not considered trivia; they are fundamental to football and the realm of records and statistics. Here are examples from the Guinness World Records, UEFA, Opta (the official provider of Premier League statistics), and many others. So, on what basis do you consider penalty kicks to be trivia?
• The same applies to headers, free kicks, and so on... I don't understand how you consider them trivia when there is comprehensive data on goals based on the method of scoring in most recognized football organizations and associations.
• Ferguson is the most successful in terms of official titles in history, while the other coach has the most league titles, and there's a big difference. Both achievements deserve to be included in the article, so I don't think there's any confusion or that they should be considered trivia!

ِAlso, you are reverting recently updated information, such as Cristiano Ronaldo's goals. Please stop and resort to discussion first. At least two editors are against you, and you are the only one opposing, so the majority is not with you. Please adhere to what is stated WP:BOLD, revert, discuss cycle and do not revert until a consensus is reached. --Mishary94 (talk) 12:30, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

No Wikipedia football article differentiates by type of goal in statistics sections. No Wikipedia football article included assists. It is irrelevant that Opta, a stats organisation, has stats on type of goal, we on Wikipedia do not include this information as it is trivial. Attempting to include this information is bold and it is you who needs to reach a consensus to include such information. All my warmest wishes, ItsKesha (talk) 18:23, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

Assists

Could the assist records on the page - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assist_(association_football) - be incorporated into this web page of world association football records?

I note that even the "Assist" Wikipedia page does not include career assists, such as Ferenc Puskas' record of 404 career assists.

https://www.pesstatsdatabase.com/who-has-the-most-assists-in-soccer/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.62.110.203 (talk) 02:04, 22 September 2024 (UTC)